Table of Contents for this Episode
563 Bootcamp 2025 Report (Sept 14)
Annie Sargent: This is Join Us in France, episode 563, cinq cent soixante-trois.
Annie Sargent: Bonjour, I’m Annie Sargent and Join Us in France is the podcast where we take a conversational journey through the beauty, culture, and flavors of France.
[00:00:31] Today’s Episode
Annie Sargent: Today, I bring you the Bootcamp report with Janet Boyd, Beth Hall, Mary Piltch, and Jeanne Powanda. And they share their experiences at Bootcamp 2025.
Annie Sargent: We chat about what it’s like hanging out with a group of fellow Francophiles, the visits we enjoyed, French classes at LangueOnze in Toulouse, I mean, the whole thing, you know, the whole experience.
[00:00:56] Bootcamp 2026
Annie Sargent: I’ve also launched the sales page for Bootcamp 2026, and I received four reservations already. That was fast!
Annie Sargent: Patrons get first dibs, then in a few days, I’ll send an email to all the people who subscribed to my newsletter, and I’ll share the URL of the sales page here on the podcast next week.
Annie Sargent: But just to put a bug in your ear, it will be early October 2026. Maybe you can join us in France for real in 2026?
[00:01:29] Podcast supporters
Annie Sargent: This podcast is fueled by chocolatine, coffee and the generosity of listeners like you.
Annie Sargent: You book itinerary consults, take my Voicemap tours, join the Bootcamp, hop in my electric car for a day trip, or chip in on Patreon, and I am so grateful for that.
Annie Sargent: Want to keep me going and skip the ads, there’s a link for that in the show notes as well.
Annie Sargent: You’ll find all of my tours and services at joinusinfrance.com/boutique. And merci beaucoup.
[00:02:02] Magazine segment
Annie Sargent: For the Magazine part of the podcast, after my chat with boot campers, I’ll update you on the strike and blockages situation, today actually, September 2025, and problems with over-tourism in Montmartre.
Annie Sargent: Did you know that this podcast gets transcribed and spell-checked? French spelling can be a bit mysterious, but you’ll find the show notes including links to the transcripts at joinusinfrance.com/episodes. It’s mighty helpful when searching the website for gold as well. You pan the website for gold, I guess.
Annie Sargent: And if you remember what episode number you want to check out, you can always type joinusinfrance.com/ and the number of the episode. So in this case, today would be 563, the numeral. And that episode will pop up.
Annie Sargent: And in my weekly newsletter, I send you a summary of the conversation with all the places we mentioned and all the useful links.
Annie Sargent: So I do recommend that you subscribe to the newsletter at joinusinfrance.com/newsletter, because it is the best way to stay in the loop.
[00:03:25] Janet Boyd
Annie Sargent: Bonjour, Janet Boyd. Welcome to Join us in France.
Janet Boyd: Bonjour, Annie. I’m happy to join.
Annie Sargent: Lovely to see you. We haven’t seen each other for a few months now. So I want to talk to you about your Bootcamp experience. It’s August by the time we record this, so you’ve had time to think about it and reflect upon it. So I’d love to hear how it went for you.
Janet Boyd: Well, it was everything I’d hoped for. I’m not a group traveler typically, but I said, “Oh my gosh, these are going to be my people. They are Francophiles. They want to travel.” it always felt like a small group even though we were, like, 30 to 35. It never felt that way. I mean, we needed a proper bus for certain things. My husband feels like he now knows some of the people because I would … You’d wind up going into smaller groups and it’d be like, “Oh, the group where we had the, you know, the retired pediatrician. Oh, that group who,” you know, blah, blah, blah. And as we took the tours and the different, you know, after the language classes, which they were very accommodating to us knowing that we were there for the week, rather … And also the students, when we went into the class, a lot of students had been there for months. But going to Albi and Carcassonne and … I knew at some point that I was going, it was going to blur after, like, which city…which was which because there’s so many gorgeous places. And so I don’t remember specifically unless I look at my pictures.
Janet Boyd: But I do remember Elyse’s descriptions, it was just so much richer with Elyse telling us. Like, if I went to … “Oh yeah, here’s a nice castle.” But I have a real sense of the history, and it wasn’t facts and figures, not at all.
Janet Boyd: One of the things I remember was a place that we went to that had the … it was a, not a catapult, what’s the other catapult?
Annie Sargent: Oh, that was Foix. That was the defensive in Foix. So that was in the Ariege area.
Janet Boyd: So she said to us, I said, “I want you to look, here we have a round tower, right? Which is built, you know, in whatever century. And on the other side, we have a square tower, and I want you to know that the difference between the two is that the round ones were built after the invention of the cannonballs because they deflect cannonballs.”
Janet Boyd: And you know, it just, it was a fun fact that you walk away going, I never would have thought of that.”
Janet Boyd: Right.
Janet Boyd: I never would have noticed that. And it’s really kind of … it’s interesting, and there were just, there were so many things that, you know, and she was just fabulous in making…
Annie Sargent: Oh, she has a knack for bringing it all together, like, in a way that honestly I can’t do that. I would like to. I try to learn from her, but she just has a knack. Because sometimes people have challenged her on specific dates and things and she will get a detail here and there wrong. That’s fine, but the overall image that she builds
Annie Sargent: is just extraordinary.
Annie Sargent: So yeah. I just think she gives a fantastic tour, whether it’s the Bootcamp or outside of the Bootcamp, she does, you know, she’s a great tour guide.
Janet Boyd: And with no notes. She does it with no notes.
Annie Sargent: That’s right.
Janet Boyd: I was like, how does she do that?”
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Janet Boyd: And her excitement is kind of infectious becausewhen they were doing excavation and they found another piece of a Roman wall, and it’s just, you know, a piece of a construction site. And we walked over there and she was telling us all about this. Yeah.
Annie Sargent: She’s so excited about these things. And you know, I’ve known about these places forever, and I kind of tried to talk her out of taking us there. She’s like, “There’s not that much to see.” And she’s like, “Well, this is really important. This is really important.” Okay. So yeah. The whole thing about the like-minded people is also a big one.
Janet Boyd: We realized we were a self-selecting group in the end, and that just made for lots of friendships and fun conversations, which is one of the things you hope for.
Janet Boyd: And it really, you called it a Bootcamp, and it was just in terms, like, falling into bed every night and going to sleep and being glad I didn’t have any homework for the school. But the morning when I got up, I was so energized, you know, and for the variety of things that we did,you know, just breaking up, and so there are people who didn’t do the class, of course, and they found all kinds of things to do.
Annie Sargent: Oh, sure.
Janet Boyd: The trip took place during my work year where so I couldn’t extend, you know, on either end. I couldn’t take that much time away because… United States, you know. But my plan is to go back and spend more time. I would go back,and I know one of the Bootcampers is going back to Toulouse for a month in October.
Annie Sargent: Yes. Oh, Toulouse is fabulous … We’re very lucky because it’s still low-key enough…. but there’s so much you can do. Even if you don’t go to the morning language classes, which I think people who want to learn the language should. They should avail themselves of that, because it’s really a good way to cram in, you know, quickly.
Annie Sargent: What level were you at?
Janet Boyd: I was A2, which was good for getting kickstarted again.
Janet Boyd: Yeah.
Janet Boyd: And I continued the French with iTalki since I’ve been back, and now I’m B1.
Janet Boyd: Yay.
Annie Sargent: Finally. Finally.
Janet Boyd: It takes a long time to learn a language. But really, it’s always a privilege to see how close people get to one another, because a lot of people come without their significant other. You know? Yeah. And so you come by yourself. You’re like, “Oh, am I going to be lonely? Am I going to be bored? Am I going to find people to hang out with after the visits are done, or after the classes are done?” I don’t think anybody had any problems with that. Oh, no.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. And we have a fabulous… Every time, we have some really nice, really classy people. Like, you know, I mean, two of the people who were at the Bootcamp own private planes.
Janet Boyd: Oh, really?
Annie Sargent: Really. I was surprised. I was like, “Wow.”
Janet Boyd: And one owned a vineyard.
Janet Boyd: Yes, that’s right, one owned a vineyard.You’re an academic. I can’t remember what you do.I’m a dean at a college.
Annie Sargent: There you go. A lot of really interesting people to talk to. We’ve had an opera singer. We’ve had an eye doctor. We had a pilot, You know, we have really, really interesting people, a bit of all ages as well.
Annie Sargent: Which is kind of refreshing to have a bit of everything.
Janet Boyd: It skewed more… I think it was more people my age. I mean, I’ll just say I’m in my 50s, my later 50s. But that was also interesting, because people, it was all over the United States, and we had Australia and the UK too.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Janet Boyd: But it was… And it was a lot of solo travelers you know, who, whether they were paired up at home or not, all who had the same loves and interests. And the variety of the trips, I think it was really, it was paced well in terms of we didn’t go to, like, a medieval town three days in a row. We went to a vineyard one day, and then we went, you know, it was broken up in ways.
Annie Sargent: We mix it up. Did you have a favorite? Did something stand out in your mind?
Janet Boyd: Now, I do remember someone counting, I guess it was Foix, walking up the cobblestones, the hill was 28 flights, equivalent to 28 flights. We all felt very accomplished. But maybe it was also there, is that where we had the storm, the thunderstorm ?
Annie Sargent: Ah, no, that was Bruniquel where we had the thunderstorm.
Janet Boyd: Okay.
Annie Sargent: And Bruniquel is interesting because it has two chateaus. It has a new chateau and an old chateau. And the new one, of course, is, you know, 800 years old.
Janet Boyd: I think that’s the one with the two different towers.
Annie Sargent: Oh, okay. That’s the one, Bruniquel. Yes. Yes. A lot of people really liked Bruniquel. It was our first time going there. I think we’ll have to go back, because it’s really scenic, and it was really atmospheric because we had the storm, you know?
Janet Boyd: Yeah. Well, that was fun. And for the people on the podcast, it was beautiful when we got there. A squall came in in about 20 minutes, and we’re all standing in the castle, and all of a sudden the lights go out, and everyone was, “Whoo.” But it was funny because you don’t realize how dark a castle really is, until the lights go out. Yeah.
Annie Sargent: That’s right. That’s right. You don’t realize that without… You know, now we understand better that they lived with the sun. The people in the Middle Ages, they had to live with the sun. Otherwise, it was too dark to do anything, you know, the rest of the time. And even on an overcast day, like a winter’s day or something where it’s overcast and you don’t get a lot of light in the room, there’s a lot of things you cannot do because no light.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. So it’s fun. And it’s the mix of just language, and culture, and you know, a lot of these people, a lot of these tours, they just say context, you know, we give it context, whatever. Of course, that’s what we do. We both, both Elyse and I live in France. I’m French born and raised, in my case, and so we want people to come and enjoy the South of France. And especially having people not all go to the same places, that’s a biggie for me. Like, you know, go spread it around a bit. Go see the rest of France, it’s lovely.
Janet Boyd: Yeah. These were places I would love to see, but I don’t know that I would’ve done it on my own.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Janet Boyd: So that was another big plus for me.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. You couldn’t get to these, most of these places without a vehicle, you have to have a car.
Annie Sargent: And not everybody is happy driving in France. Although driving in France is statistically a lot safer than driving in the US.
Janet Boyd: I live in New Jersey, so if you can drive in New Jersey, you can drive anywhere.
Annie Sargent: Wonderful. Wonderful. Well, Janet, thank you so much for talking to me.
Janet Boyd: Oh, thank you. Any hints about the next Bootcamp?
Annie Sargent: Well, yes. We are going to do this in October next time, because May, it’s too many days off. It’s really hard to find a time that works for everybody. And April, it’s a bit too rainy still. So, we thought, you know, we hesitated. We hesitated. By the time you listen to this interview,
Annie Sargent: I’ll announce the date and all of that. But I think it’s going to be October.
Janet Boyd: Not 2025, 2026.
Janet Boyd: Okay.
Annie Sargent: Oh, no. We just do this once a year.
Annie Sargent: And Elyse has told me again she might not, this might be her last one, but she said that last time.
Annie Sargent: Right.
Annie Sargent: We’ll see. We’ll see. Hopefully, she’ll feel good enough to continue, because she, you know, she’s a trooper. It’s hard work. So thank you very much, Janet. It’s lovely seeing you again.
Annie Sargent: Thank you so much.
Janet Boyd: Looking forward to the next one.
Janet Boyd: Take care.
Janet Boyd: Au revoir.
(Ad Spot 1)
[00:13:43] Beth Hall
Annie Sargent: Bonjour, Beth Hall. How are you?
Beth Hall: I’m good. Bonjour, Annie.
Annie Sargent: Welcome to Join us in France.
Annie Sargent: So, you were one of the Bootcampers, for this May 2025, and we want to hear about your experience. Why you came, where you’re from, how it was, everything.
Beth Hall: My name is Beth Hall. I am from Kentucky. I was the only person from Kentucky. I think there was another person from the Midwest, but I was able to meet people from all over the world, Australia, England. It was wonderful getting to meet the different people, a lot of like-minded people that love to travel and love France.
Beth Hall: I was able to get away, because I have a little bit of a flexible schedule. My husband was very, very jealous that he had to stay behind and work, but he gets to come in September when we come back, so we get to go do some of the same things we did on my trip, because I loved them so much.
Annie Sargent: So yeah, that’s right, because we were just chatting a while back about you redoing part of this trip and showing your husband, right?
Beth Hall: Yes, yes. I was very surprised by how lively Toulouse was. It was a wonderful place in France that some of the books don’t even include anything about Toulouse, and it just was wonderful. Lots of interesting things in terms of architecture, and again, the city was just very lively.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Beth Hall: And I really enjoyed that aspect.
Annie Sargent: We have a lot of students in Toulouse, so of course it’s lively, and people like to go out. People in Toulouse, I mean, just ask Elyse. She will just get on the metro and go into downtown Toulouse just to be in downtown Toulouse because she likes hanging out there.
Beth Hall: Right. Yeah, just people out and about, and I don’t … I can’t think of in the United States where you really have that as much as I saw in Toulouse.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, yeah. Well, wonderful. Did you do also the language classes?
Beth Hall: I did not. I am at the very beginning of trying to learn French.
Beth Hall: Felt it might be a little overwhelming to come, I had some family issues with my dad, so it wasn’t until last minute that I made the decision that I could truly come because of his health. So, just felt like wanted that free time to explore on my own.
Beth Hall: And I think I would like to do that on the next one. I’d like to come back to the Bootcamp and try the language class this time.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. No, they’re really fun, but it’s true that you don’t have to take them. It’s just optional, and the good thing about not taking them is that you have every morning to yourself, well, every weekday morning to yourself. The weekend mornings are … Well, the whole day, you know, we do … This year we started on a Saturday and we ended a Sunday a week later. I don’t think we’re going to do that again, honestly. I think we’ll be doing Saturday to Saturday going forward because it was long. It was … It felt, especially for Elyse and I, every day you have to be on, and for you guys, too. I mean, it’s a very packed-in … Even if you don’t do the language classes, you … Did you ever feel bored?
Beth Hall: Oh, no, no. The first Monday, I had come from Paris, so I kind of took it easy that Monday morning and just relaxed, but no, I found plenty to do, out and about. Yeah, there’s a lot to do in Toulouse.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. So, Beth, you don’t come across as the most outgoing person in the group. There are some people that were like super talkative and all that. You’re a bit more reserved, aren’t you?
Beth Hall: Sometimes. I like more one-on-one than a big group situation, so…
Beth Hall: Yeah. That’s probably it more than being shy. I feel like I’m not shy. I’m just, you know … I don’t … When it’s a group, sometimes I kind of step back and just kind of observe.
Annie Sargent: Yes, yes, yes. And so did you make connections? Did you make friends that you’re still in touch with at this point?
Beth Hall: I did. I am … Been bad about staying on the WhatsApp. There’s a WhatsApp that continues, and I had a lot to come back to, so I’ve been pretty busy.
Beth Hall: Right.
Annie Sargent: But no, I intend to keep in contact with a lot o… keep in contact with people. What sort of work do you do?
Beth Hall: I stayed home with my kids, so-
Annie Sargent: Oh, you … But that keeps you very busy.
Beth Hall: Yeah, right now, you know, I’m helping with my father.
Annie Sargent: Had to find out what was going on with him, but… Yeah, that’s … Yeah, and he’s hanging in, isn’t he?
Annie Sargent: Yeah. He’s still hanging in there. That’s good. Good for him. I’m sure your help is invaluable, at this point.
Annie Sargent: So tell me about the, some of the attractions we went to that you are most interested in, the ones that you want to go back to.
Beth Hall: I loved Albi. We plan to go back to the church, actually with you, I think we’re doing a day trip to go there.
Beth Hall: I ended up with a stomach bug one day, so I didn’t get to see Pech Merle, or was it Cord…?-
Annie Sargent: It was Saint-Cirq-Lapopie.
Annie Sargent: And also, we … On that day we stopped in Rodez.
Beth Hall: So I didn’t get to do that, so I plan to do those things on-
Annie Sargent: Not Rodez, not Rodez, sorry.
Annie Sargent:
Beth Hall: I can’t remember.
Annie Sargent: Mm. Brain fart. Anyway, there’s three things we visited that day, and I can’t remember the third one.
Beth Hall: I really enjoyed Elyse’s different tours that she did. She’s like a walking encyclopedia with so much information and so knowledgeable.
Beth Hall: The bus trips were fun, even the singing even … even though I don’t like to sing.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, some groups … I always test this, some groups love to sing. This one this year, they were like, “Eh, not so into it,” so, we’ll see. But I’ll keep trying it because some groups really get into it, so …
Beth Hall: No, that was kind of fun.
Annie Sargent: So yes, that day, that we go to Pech Merle and Saint-Cirq-Lapopie, we also go to Cahors. We just go to the bridge because we don’t really have time for much else, but … So you missed that day, okay?
Beth Hall: Yeah.
Beth Hall: Because you were sick. Sorry.
Beth Hall: Yeah. No, it’s … I wish I could have gone, but you know.
Beth Hall: Yeah.
Beth Hall: I really love Bruniquel.
Annie Sargent: Oh, Bruniquel, yes, yes.
Beth Hall: The medieval town, the architecture, just… so quaint and beautiful. I wish I could live there.
Beth Hall: It’s very hilly. You’d get legs of steel, woman. Yeah. But no, it’s just breathtakingly beautiful. You just stand there and look and think, do places like this really exist?
Beth Hall: They do, so …
Annie Sargent: Yes. And that day we ran into a pretty big storm.
Annie Sargent: It was crazy. Like, all of a sudden, it just started thundering and lightening.
Annie Sargent: Were you in the chateau when we lost the power?
Beth Hall: Yes. I didn’t take my rain gear because it didn’t say it was going to rain, and then all of a sudden you see all these black clouds coming and then… didn’t power go out for a short time too in the chateau?
Annie Sargent: I was in the chateau. A lot of us were in the chateau, and all of a sudden, boom, you know, the lightning hit a substation. So it took a good long time for the power to come back, but it did eventually come back. But it made it very atmospheric. We were in this medieval chateau, very medieval chateau with no power, I’m like, “Ooh.”
Beth Hall: Carcassonne was another place that I really, really enjoyed, and to … my husband and I are going to go back along with a cousin to Carcassonne.
Annie Sargent: How did you like the food in Toulouse?
Beth Hall: I went out a few times with the group. It was good. I’m not a big foodie.
Beth Hall: Uh-huh.
Beth Hall: I did a lot of sandwiches, ham sandwiches. A lot of pastries in the morning, the chocolat croissants, pain au chocolat, I believe.
Annie Sargent: Pain au Chocolat, yes. Or chocolatine, as we say in the Southwest.
Beth Hall: No, I wasn’t as … I guess I didn’t explore as much with the food.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You’re not super food motivated.
Beth Hall: No, the people were really nice about including me, because I was by myself. So several times people had asked me to come to dinner, and sometimes I was just kind of worn out and chose to go back to the room.
Beth Hall: But that was really nice, being by myself, that was one of the things I was a little nervous about coming. I remember sending a message, “Hey, will there be other people that are going to be solo?”
Beth Hall: There were. There were a lot of people that were solo and they were very kind to include me.
Beth Hall: That meant a lot of wonderful people on the trip.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, that’s one of the nice things about being in a group, is that you can travel solo to places that you probably wouldn’t by yourself, or maybe you would, but in this case, you know, you might feel a bit intimidated to come to a place like this by yourself, but then you have a group, and you had us leading the way and showing everybody around.
Annie Sargent: I guess it makes it easier….
Beth Hall: Lot of learning curves along the way. We’ve traveled, my husband and I have traveled quite a bit, but he usually navigates, so I’ve had to do all the trains, buses, airplanes, all of that by myself.
Beth Hall: I almost ended up going the wrong direction on the train. I figured it out at the last minute because when it … the platform, on the screen it told me to go to the specific platform, and I got there and got on the train and my seat assignment wasn’t anywhere to be found. So luckily, I figured out that I was on the wrong train, but I hadn’t seen that where there’s two trains on the same platform going in two different directions.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, that’s … They might have different platform numbers? But I would think so.
Beth Hall: Yeah, the other train was literally on the other side.
Annie Sargent: My husband would have made the same mistake too, but I figured it out and ended up on the right train, so …
Beth Hall: Yeah, lots of learning curves, but I am so glad I did it on my own.
Beth Hall: Why do you want to come back to the Bootcamp? I mean, I’m glad, but why?
Beth Hall: I had so much fun. I really enjoyed it. You pick out fabulous things to do, and I’m getting to meet the different people from all over, was a lot of fun.
Beth Hall: And a lot of people that love to travel, again, love France, and getting to talk to them and hearing, you know, travel ideas or places they’ve been, that kind of thing, so …
Beth Hall: Yeah. That’s fantastic.
Annie Sargent: Well, thank you very much for talking to me. I think I need to get some other people on, but it’s going to be a delight to see you again this October. You’re coming back in…
Beth Hall: Back in September, yes.
Annie Sargent: September, September, sorry.
Annie Sargent: Yes.
Annie Sargent: I have other bookings in October, but yeah. So September, and it will be wonderful to meet your husband and your cousin and we’ll have a good time, and then perhaps you’ll come back to the Bootcamp next year. That’s wonderful.
Beth Hall: If the timing works out, I definitely plan to come.
Annie Sargent: Wonderful. Thank you very much, Beth.
Annie Sargent: Au revoir.
Annie Sargent: Au revoir.
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[00:23:55] Mary Piltch
Annie Sargent: Bonjour, Mary Piltch. Welcome to Join Us in France.
Mary Piltch: Thank you. Thank you very much, Annie.
Annie Sargent: Wonderful to see you again. You were at the Bootcamp and I want to hear what your experience was like. Tell us a little bit about yourself and what decided you to come to the Bootcamp?
Mary Piltch: Okay, great. Well, I’ve been listening to Join Us in France since the pandemic actually. And I’ve continued to listen to it. I listened to all the old episodes, you know, that you recorded before there. It’s so interesting and your guests are great. And you and Elyse do such a nice job together. I live in Cape Cod in Massachusetts. I’m retired. I’m a grandmother, and I have three kids who live in the Boston area too, so that’s pretty much me.
Annie Sargent: Right, right. And you, I remember you were a little bit hesitant, you were like, “Oh, I’m coming by myself. Is this going to be a problem?” I don’t think it ended up being a problem at all, did it?
Mary Piltch: No, I don’t know, I’ve traveled by myself, you know, I’ve done it many times. And I also, you know, do a group tour where I’m alone, so that’s usually not a problem, and I was able to meet a couple of other gals from Massachusetts. And we met together. I met one of them on Cape Cod and we had coffee at a French cafe which was on the cape, which was nice. So I knew, you know, having that Zoom call ahead of time was really good because you could find out if other people are around you and meet them on Zoom, so that was very helpful.
Annie Sargent: Yes. Yes. Yes. So what did you enjoy about the Bootcamp? Did you do the language classes as well?
Mary Piltch: I did do the language class, yes. Yeah.
Mary Piltch: Okay.
Mary Piltch: Well, we started everything off great because the gals from Massachusetts got together with you the day before and did a great trip to… I don’t remember the name of the area.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. We did a day trip, I can’t remember. I remember some of it, it was all the Tarn-et-Garonne.
Mary Piltch: There we go, yes, yes. I can’t get enough of cute French town, so it was lovely. We had a great lunch. We found a nice place, that we all enjoyed. So that was a great way to start it off. And I was very impressed by Toulouse. I did not expect it to be such a vibrant, thriving historical city, not knowing that it was the fourth largest in France. Is that correct?
Mary Piltch: Yes. We’re edging to third largest now, but ..
Mary Piltch: Wow, oh, okay. And when I arrived, I was so impressed with how many young people there were. I didn’t realize it was a university town. So that was off to a good start. It was a great group of people. Again, like I said, having the Zoom was very helpful. I did take the French language class. I have to say, I did play hooky a couple of days. Because there was just other things I wanted to do and see in Toulouse. I was thinking, “Oh, you know, I’ll do enough with the day trips that we do in the afternoon.” But there was really so much more to see, so… and my French is so poor anyway that, you know, five days of French isn’t going to help mine at all. So I made the right decision.
Annie Sargent: Yes, yes, yes. Well, it is true that there’s a lot to do in Toulouse and the Bootcamp is… I mean, we call it a Bootcamp because we try to do a lot and you just get the half a day on your own, during the Bootcamp, which for some people is not enough.
Mary Piltch: Yes. Yeah, for sure. So, one of the things I did on my own was to go to the Museum of the Resistance, which was very good.
Mary Piltch: And subsequently, Elyse was kind enough to give us a little talk about the Resistance, which was very helpful because I personally didn’t know that much about it, and I’ve watched a couple of documentaries that she suggested and read more about it. So that, you know, to me that was very interesting, you know, I’m interested in the history. I also do a lot of long distance walks with friends usually, but we’ve walked part of the Camino de Santiago andpart of the Via Francigena in Italy, and I was very interested to find that part of the Camino goes through Toulouse.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Mary Piltch: So I went back to… What’s the church, the cathedral there in Toulouse?
Annie Sargent: The cathedral is Saint-Etienne, and the basilica is Saint-Sernin.
Mary Piltch: Okay.
Mary Piltch: It was the basilica then.
Annie Sargent: It’s the basilica, I think, yeah.
Mary Piltch: Yeah. And, you know, learned more about that. And I took, on one of my hooky days, I tookElyse’s audio guide and walked around. And even though she had taken us before and, you know, we had seen a lot of Toulouse,there were things that I hadn’t noticed before, had learned so much more, and that was great. You and Elyse just do such a fabulous job of keeping everybody in line as well as so many interesting things about history and culture and people and food. It’s really a great combination. I really enjoyed it.
Annie Sargent: Thank you. Thank you. Yes. We have a good time as well because we get to meet new people and it’s always just, you know, it’s fun. It’s fun.
Mary Piltch: Well, I’m glad it’s fun for you too, as well.
Annie Sargent: Well, it’s a big responsibility because I do feel like I’m in charge of a large group and I’m always on the lookout for things that might go possibly wrong. But so far, we’ve been lucky. We’ve had really… I should relax a little bit is the reality.
Mary Piltch: No, I’m the same way. You have to have like a plan B ready just in case, you know?
Annie Sargent: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Did you have a favorite excursion or two, perhaps, that we did?
Mary Piltch: Well, as I said, you know, I can’t get enough of the little French towns. And I’m sorry, I should have looked this up before. I don’t remember the names of some of the places. But on Sunday, we went to that other cathedral.
Annie Sargent: On Sunday, we went to Albi.
Mary Piltch: Albi, yes, that was it. Yep. So I loved Albi. That is really a highlight, I think. The only drawback was that it rained quite a bit on that day. And we also went to the Toulouse-Lautrec Museum.
Annie Sargent: Okay, okay. It rained on that day? I don’t remember the rain. Maybe it did.
Mary Piltch: Yeah, it was rainy.
Annie Sargent: Okay, it happens.
Mary Piltch: And the only other thing is because it’s Sunday, a lot of things aren’t open, so it was very quiet in Albi, probably a combination of the rain and it being Sunday.
Annie Sargent: That’s true.
Mary Piltch: And I guess one suggestion I would… Maybe you could do the caves on a Sunday, and do Albi on a weekday, but that’s just a suggestion.
Annie Sargent: That’s a great suggestion. We’ll see if we can do that.
Annie Sargent: The thing is, Albi takes a full day because Elyse really gives a great tour of the museum, the Toulouse-Lautrec Museum, and the cathedral, and the basilica. And so, we need time, but yes, that’s an excellent suggestion that we will take into account.
Mary Piltch: And of course, Carcassonne is beautiful, and I actually had been there before, and it rained when I was in Carcassonne before. But it was beautiful when we went. So I think I’ll go back again because it was raining. It was really windy and raining when I went, and so we didn’t really do that much.
Mary Piltch: But again, Elyse did amazinghistory information about the church that’s there, which of course I don’t remember the name of.
Annie Sargent: Saint-Nazaire.
Mary Piltch: Yes, and I had seen it before and thought it was, you know, amazing, but knowing all this information is just so, it really adds so much to the trip.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. Yeah. Do you have any tips for anybody who’s considering doing this things that you want to tell them about to prepare?
Mary Piltch: Well, definitely do it. I really enjoyed it. You really have to fly to Toulouse, I think. I had gone to Avignon from Charles de Gaulle, and that’s super easy to take by the train, but Toulouse is not as easy. So, I would say to take a flight. And I don’t know, just be ready for d- uh, different experiences that you may not be aware of. And you meet some great people, and you guys really set it up for success, having the WhatsApp and having Zoom calls before.
Mary Piltch: It’s more than just going on a trip with people you don’t know. You kind of know them ahead of time, and you all have the same objectives and love of France. So, it’s a great trip to go on.
Mary Piltch: Yep, yep. All right. Thank you very much, Mary. You’re wonderful to talk to. It was a delight having you on the bootcamp. Thank you. My pleasure.
Annie Sargent: Who knows? You might come back to Toulouse one of these days.
Mary Piltch: Yes, I might, but I may not take the French language course, but that’s just me.
Mary Piltch: But I know a lot of people loved it, you know, especially the ones who were better French speakers.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, there’s nothing wrong with the school. It’s just that, yeah, I think if you come with some French under your belt, it makes it more challenging. If it’s just learning the very basics, maybein any language, a week isn’t going to make any miracles. You know what I mean?
Mary Piltch: Correct. Yeah.
Annie Sargent: It takes longer than that, so.
Mary Piltch: The people who were, you know, fairly fluent in French, I think they really got a lot out of it because they were able to converse with other people in French, which you don’t always have the opportunity here in the United States, especially, you know, native French speakers. So I think for that level, it’s really a good course.
Annie Sargent: Where were you staying? Was it a hotel or an Airbnb?
Annie Sargent:
Mary Piltch: No, I stayed at a hotel. I can’t remember. I should have researched this, like I said. I stayed, oh, in that there’s a circle and there’s a fountain in the middle. It’s right down the street from where we got the bus.
Annie Sargent: Okay, so probably the Place Wilson, the big… was it the Novotel?
Mary Piltch: Yes, it was. Yes, yeah, yeah, that’s it.
Annie Sargent: Okay, Novotel in Place Wilson. Okay. Yeah, that’s a good one.
Mary Piltch: You know what? My room, it was not loud at all. I must have faced inward instead of outward, because when I got there, I thought, “Oh my gosh, it might be really noisy,” but it wasn’t.
Mary Piltch: The hotel wasn’t too lively. You know, it didn’t have a great restaurant, but of course, everything’s right around there. And I was so close to the big square and everything. So it was really, it was a convenient location.
Mary Piltch: I know, the other gals from the Cape stayed at an Airbnb that they found noisy, and the air conditioning wasn’t working that well. So you never know. But I was very happy with where I stayed.
Annie Sargent: Did you like the food in the area? Did you have a favorite?
Mary Piltch: I have to say, I’m not a big foodie, and I’ve had the cassoulet, and I’m just not a big fan of cassoulet.
Mary Piltch: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Mary Piltch: I can’t say anything that really stuck out. But the food is lovely. Yeah.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, you didn’t go hungry.
Mary Piltch: No, definitely not. No, no.
Mary Piltch: How about the wine? You came to the wine tasting with us.
Mary Piltch: That was a highlight too. What a lovely couple, and you know, what a lovely spot. They did an amazing job. Yeah, that was a lot of fun. I love a wine tasting. In fact, I went with two of the otherbootcamp participants, and we did a little wine tasting on our own, with a guide. And I think there were six people in total, and we went to that, the one that has all the wines that you pour from the little spout in the machine, and you put your card in.
Annie Sargent: Le Cinq, perhaps?
Mary Piltch: Do you know what I’m talking about?
Annie Sargent: Number five?
Mary Piltch: Yeah, Le Cinq. That was cool to see that. That was fun. I know some other people wanted to go back, but I think it was closed that day or something. Yeah.
Annie Sargent: All right, we got to keep it short, but wonderful to see you again. Wonderful to talk to you.
Mary Piltch: Thank you. You too.
Annie Sargent: Thank you very much, Mary.
Mary Piltch: Okay, take care. Enjoy the rest of your summer.
Annie Sargent: Thank you. You too.
Mary Piltch: Au revoir.
Annie Sargent: Au revoir.
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[00:34:15] Jeanne Powanda
Annie Sargent: Bonjour, Jeanne Powanda. Welcome to Join us in France.
Jeanne Powanda: Bonjour, Annie. It’s good to see you.
Annie Sargent: Good to see you, too. So we want to talk about your time at the Bootcamp 2025. Have you recovered?
Jeanne Powanda: I have recovered. And my bank account’s recovered, thank goodness.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, yeah. It takes a little bit for that too. Did you do just the Bootcamp or also the language classes?
Jeanne Powanda: I also did language class.
Annie Sargent: All right. And what level of French were you at?
Annie Sargent: They put me in A1, I believe. Okay. So you’re starting out.
Jeanne Powanda: I was… Well, I had some French in high school and a little bit in college. I think I was put in a class that was a little too easy.
Annie Sargent: Uh-huh.
Jeanne Powanda: And the teacher acknowledged that. But, you know, it’s only five days, a couple of hours, it was still… It was okay.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Jeanne Powanda: Would I do it again? No.
Annie Sargent: Mm-hmm. You wouldn’t do the language class again?
Jeanne Powanda: I would not. A conversational French class would have been, I think more helpful.
Annie Sargent: Oh, because… So this was kind of more like you spent time doing grammar and things?
Jeanne Powanda: We were doing the alphabet, and then we did countries, and then we did numbers and…
Annie Sargent: Ah, too simple.
Jeanne Powanda: Too simple.
Jeanne Powanda: Uh-huh. Uh-huh.
Annie Sargent: Well, that’s good to know. That’s good to know, because there are people who might want to… Because, I mean, the language classes are completely separate, you don’t have to do the language classes. I think that people who are more advanced find them very useful, but perhaps for a beginner, it’s not as good.
Jeanne Powanda: Yeah. The good part was my class began at 8:45 AM and so I had to get moving.
Jeanne Powanda: Yes, yes.
Jeanne Powanda: I couldn’t lounge in bed. I had to get up.
Annie Sargent: There’s no lounging.
Jeanne Powanda: So, that was a good thing.
Annie Sargent: It is a Bootcamp. So besides that, how was the Bootcamp experience? Did you make some good friends? Did you see some cool stuff?
Jeanne Powanda: I loved it. It was an experience for me because I was alone. My husband didn’t want to go. And so I learned a lot about myself and what I can do. And now I can do anything. I’m brave.
Annie Sargent: It empowered you, I guess.
Jeanne Powanda: It empowered me. There you go. It empowered me. That part of it was the best part for just, personally, for me. And meeting you and Elyse was a highlight. I loved Toulouse and this was my fourth trip to France, and I’m really happy that I got to see that part of France. You know, I’ve been to Paris, I’ve been to the Normandy, Loire,Alsace, I’ve been to Nice, you know, and so I hadn’t been to the Southwest and so now I’ve kind of covered everything.
Annie Sargent: A lot of places, yeah. I mean, the Atlantic, perhaps. The Atlantic Coast, the central parts of France. You have a few things you haven’t seen, but…
Jeanne Powanda: A few things. A few. But it was good to kind of cover most areas.
Annie Sargent: Yes, yes. Anything surprised you about Toulouse or the places we went?
Jeanne Powanda: I was surprised by how flat Toulouse was. Very, very, very, very walkable. When I got there, I bought a metro pass for ten rides and I only used five because everything was so walkable.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Annie Sargent: I didn’t really need the metro pass. I actually gave it… It was a paper pass, so it’s… I don’t think they do that now. They already eliminated paper passes. And I gave it to a young woman, you know, college students or whatever. That’s nice.
Jeanne Powanda: I was surprised, Toulouse… I think I was mostly surprised by there’s all the stores and the shops and how high-end everything was.
Jeanne Powanda: Very high-end. No cheap T-shirt shops. The jewelry stores, there was a Hermes watch that was over 10,000 euros.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. That’s high-end all right.
Jeanne Powanda: That surprised me.
Jeanne Powanda: But I did find my 2 euros store to buy a few things that I need.
Annie Sargent: That’s right, there’s the 2 euros, magasin de 2 euros. Yeah.
Annie Sargent: Of the places we visited, did you have a favorite?
Jeanne Powanda: Yes. My favorite was Bruniquel. I just love the ruins. The view was, you know, over the river, was breathtaking. I loved the fact that was kind of funny, the old castle, the new castle. When the new castle is still, you know, 600 years old instead of 900 years old.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Jeanne Powanda: I just love walking through all of that, the town, walking through that beautiful town and the steep alleyways and the flowers. That was the favorite of mine. Everybody liked Carcassonne. Carcassonne is very, very nice, but it’s so touristy.
Jeanne Powanda: Bruniquel just felt like a place I could just stay for a day and relax and…
Annie Sargent: That’s true. That’s true.
Jeanne Powanda: I did like that the best. Every place was won- Foix was wonderful. Everything was wonderful.
Jeanne Powanda: I loved it all.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, yeah. I think Albi is also magnificent.
Jeanne Powanda: Albi, yes, yes.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. Did you skip any days on account of being unwell or something?
Jeanne Powanda: Yes. I missed the caves.
Annie Sargent: Ah, Pech Merle.
Annie Sargent: Yeah. I don’t know. I just had a… I just… I don’t know, just woke up at… I don’t know if I had like a little bug. There were a couple of people on the bus that… You know, nobody was really sick-sick but a little unwell.You know, it is a Bootcamp. I mean, every day like that it adds up. I think next year we’re probably going to do just seven days instead of nine, because it is kind of taxing. And we can probably fit in almost as much in, if we reorganize and rearrange a little bit, is what I’m thinking.
Annie Sargent: But honestly, you’re the second person I’ve talked to that missed Pech Merle day because of not feeling well, you know? It happens.
Jeanne Powanda: Yeah. It may have been exhaustion. I couldn’t put finger on it, the… how I felt. I just didn’t want to really get out of bed.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, yeah. So tell me, if you were going to give advice to people considering going to the Bootcamp next, one of these years, what would you tell them? How would you help them prepare?
Annie Sargent: I think I was fairly prepared. Google Maps, I did a lot of research and… Like, when I was going to my residence, I had an apartment. I already knew what to look for. You know, when I got out of the metro, I knew which way to turn, left or right, or where to go. Where did you stay?
Jeanne Powanda: I stayed at Tour Croix Barione.
Jeanne Powanda: Okay.
Jeanne Powanda: And it was such a great location. I was two blocks from the 8- 8 3A and Carme metro.
Jeanne Powanda: Yeah.
Jeanne Powanda: And a block from Langones. It’s a quiet, safe area. I was a block from Rue de Metz and a block from Alsace Lorraine, so I could get anywhere.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, it’s a great location. That’s definitely a great location.
Jeanne Powanda: I had a two-story apartment that I could have lived in. I just loved it.
Annie Sargent: And you found this… Was it one that was recommended on my website or?
Jeanne Powanda: It was not. It was not. I found it on booking.com, and then the owners actually reached out to me…
Annie Sargent: Oh.
Jeanne Powanda: … and said, “Hey, why don’t you just book directly through us?” And I said, “Oh, okay, I can do that.”
Annie Sargent: How did they know that you were interested?
Jeanne Powanda: I guess through booking.com, because I had some questions. And I guess just went to them and then they reached out to me, and that was perfectly fine. They were wonderful hosts. And there was a lot of steps. It was 36 steps to my place, but I have a big old house and it’s already 18 just to get upstairs. So…
Annie Sargent: So you’re used to it, yeah.
Jeanne Powanda: Steps don’t bother me.
Jeanne Powanda: Yeah.
Jeanne Powanda: But I loved the apartment. It was quiet. I just… I loved it.
Annie Sargent: All right, maybe you should send me the address and the contact for this person and I can recommend it for somebody who wants to stay there next time.
Jeanne Powanda: I can do that. I can do that.
Annie Sargent: Wonderful. Anything else you want to discuss,you know, about the Bootcamp that you…
Jeanne Powanda: I was… I had a lot of time on my own, because I got there on Tuesday and then stayed afterwards until Thursday. There was a lot of things that we didn’t do as the group that I got to see. And things that I would recommend to people that have time would definitely be a canal ride.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Jeanne Powanda: It’s not exciting, but it’s just so pretty at that time of year. I went to The Resistance Museum.
Annie Sargent: Oh yeah, that’s a good one.
Jeanne Powanda: I went to the Hotel d’Assézat.
Annie Sargent: Yes, exactly. That’s a beautiful one. I assume you went into the Bemberg Foundation?
Jeanne Powanda: Yes, that one… That’s what I mean, yeah. For me, the highlight was the Escher exhibit, down at, what was that called? The old pal…
Annie Sargent: Le Bazacle.
Jeanne Powanda: I was an Escher fan since I was a teenager, so that was a highlight for me.
Annie Sargent: Uh-huh, uh-huh. I saw that one too. I liked it. It was very good.
Jeanne Powanda: I loved it. I loved it. I had a massage.
Annie Sargent: Oh, wow.
Jeanne Powanda: And then I went to St. Raymond, Musee Saint-Raymond, which I loved. It was… I loved that.
Annie Sargent: It’s a very good one.
Jeanne Powanda: There’s just so much, you know, and you see so much as it is with the group and then all these…
Jeanne Powanda: There’s more. Oh yeah. We definitely don’t do everything you can do. You know, there’s a lot more that you could do in Toulouse. There is. There is. And the library was beautiful. And I got to meet people from, you know, Australia, and New Zealand, and Hawaii.
Annie Sargent: Have you stayed in touch with any of them?
Jeanne Powanda: Actually, not really. Not really. Well, so many of them were going off to other European locales, you know? I was taken back to the States, but many of them were headed off to various ports of call.
Annie Sargent: Yeah, different places, yeah.
Jeanne Powanda: Right.
Annie Sargent: Did you like the fact that we used WhatsApp to communicate? Was that handy dandy or you would rather not?
Jeanne Powanda: It was perfect.
Jeanne Powanda: And we could privately connect with each other, if we had to. I took a wine tour and met Jessica Hammer, who I believe you guys know.
Annie Sargent: Yeah.
Jeanne Powanda: And so I’m from Pittsburgh. She is a big Sidney Crosby fan, who’s a Pittsburgh Penguin. And I had some Pittsburgh Penguin hats with me that I brought over and I gave her some hats and she was so happy.
Annie Sargent: That’s great. That’s great. All right, Jean, thank you so much for… we need to keep it short because we have other people who are going to be on this episode, but thank you so much, Jean. It was wonderful having you on the Bootcamp and it’s lovely to see you again, and I hope you come back to France at some point.
Jeanne Powanda: Thank you very much. Thanks to Elyse and I’ll just keep on listening.
Jeanne Powanda: Awesome. Merci, au revoir.
Jeanne Powanda: Thank you.
[00:44:46] Thank you Patrons
Annie Sargent: Again, I want to thank my patrons for giving back and supporting the show. Patrons get several exclusive rewards for doing that, you can see them at patreon.com/joinus.
Annie Sargent: A special shout-out this week to my new Join Us in France champions, Theresa Watkins and Carol F., with whom I’ve exchanged many lovely messages already. I love talking to my patrons.
Annie Sargent: Would you join them too? You can do it for as little as three dollars a month, but if you can afford it, I would love to have you pledge more so you can have access to more of the rewards. Go to patreon.com/joinus.
Annie Sargent: And to support Elyse, go to patreon.com/elysart. And thank you, David Griffin, for your one-time donation using any green button on joinusinfrance.com that says, “Tip your guide.”
[00:45:44] VoiceMaps Reviews
Annie Sargent: Somebody left this review of my Ile de la Cite VoiceMap tour this week.
Annie Sargent: This person wrote, “Very informative tour, lots of interesting insights, easy to follow.” Well, that’s what I like to hear. That was short and sweet, but, you know, those short and sweet reviews also help.
Annie Sargent: Podcast listeners get a big discount for buying these VoiceMap tours from my website. It’s best for me as well, because I get to keep more of what you pay instead of giving it to Apple or Google.
Annie Sargent: So, go to joinusinfrance.com/boutique to get your own codes.
Annie Sargent: If you’re planning a trip to France, your vacation is precious, and you do not want to waste time chasing bad tips or outdated information. That’s where my Itinerary Consults come in. You can run your ideas by me. I’ll help steer you in the right direction so you spend less time researching, worrying, and more time just enjoying the thought of your trip to France.
Annie Sargent: Again, to book this service, you go to joinusinfrance.com/boutique.
[00:46:48] Political Situation in France
Annie Sargent: I want to update you on the political situation in France. Today was the Bloquons Tout day. They’ve been talking about this for a month. And yes, they did block a few places and they’re all over Instagram, but I swear to God, they blocked maybe a fraction of a percent of important infrastructure.
Annie Sargent: So it was a bit of a dud, and I suppose it might, … I don’t know, you never know. Are they going to keep this up or not?
Annie Sargent: When it’s a real strike, like if it’s an official strike from the train people or teachers or whatever, they don’t get paid while they’re on strike. And so they tend to be a little bit careful with how much time off they take for striking.
Annie Sargent: The people who participate in these blockages and things like that, they have less to lose usually, and so it might go on for a while. With the Gilets Jaunes, the Yellow Jackets, several years back, it had all started with a sudden, well, to them, increase in the price of taxes that we pay on gasoline. And they really upset a lot of people.I don’t like taxes any more than anybody else, but I think we should be using less gasoline, because it is destroying our planet. So to me, the only way to really incentivize people to use less gasoline is to make it more expensive, and so I did get behind that particular movement.
Annie Sargent: But on this one today, not that I’m ever going to go block anything, but I do understand that people are upset because the French government has a lot of debt, they’ve been spending like drunken sailors since the pandemic. Emmanuel Macron is not the only president who took the country in that direction, but he’s definitely made it worse.
Annie Sargent: He hasn’t had a majority in the Parliament, and ours is a parliamentarian system. So if the president doesn’t have the Parliament, well, his prime minister can’t get anything passed, and the latest prime minister has fallen, he didn’t get the votes he needed to pass his budget, so we have a new guy.
Annie Sargent: I can’t even remember his name. He was the minister of Defense, and he’s well liked and whatever, but he is a right winger. And so my fear is that he’s going to do like the previous ones. He’s going to say, “Well, we can save money by not reimbursing this, in the… you know, national healthcare thing. We can cut off this program, give less money to the handicapped,” or whatever. I’m not sure what all they’re planning, but I think they’re looking for money in the wrong place. French people are very, very price sensitive, and they are going to put up a fight. And the money really lies with a few thousand very rich people in France, just like everywhere else these days, and I think they need to go find the money where it is and not where it is not.
Annie Sargent: But that’s just me. I’ve never voted left wing in France, but I might have to do that, because they’re just annoying me. Why do they keep hitting the people who can least afford it, you know?
Annie Sargent: They need to find a way to tax the super wealthy, and we do have a lot of super wealthy in France. I’m not saying tax the dentist who spends 12 hours with his hands in people’s mouths. I mean, he’s earned it, right? But just the people who invest and the private equity crap and all that, ugh… yeah.
Annie Sargent: Anyway, I’m not a political scientist and this is not a political podcast but I think there are reasons for people to get excited over these things.
Annie Sargent: Butwe have a new prime minister already, hopefully, this person will be able to pass a budget that won’t annoy people so much, might get a little bit reasonable and then we’ll see. We’ll see where we go from there.
Annie Sargent: But it wasn’t as bad as I had feared.
[00:50:40] Montmartre Over-turism Tensions
Annie Sargent: Let’s talk about the Montmartre and the growing tensions between residents and tourism.
Annie Sargent: I’ve mentioned this in previous episodes as well. But this time it’s about the buses, because every day, dozens of large tour buses roll into Montmartre. They often park illegally, double parking, blocking crosswalks or stopping in areas where they’re not supposed to.
Annie Sargent: For the people who live there, it’s become a real problem.
Annie Sargent: One resident, Julie Menard, who has lived in the neighborhood for 10 years, has launched a petition back in 2023 and she calls it an invasion. She’s not just talking about inconvenience, but about what she sees as both visual pollution and air pollution, and she has a point. Paris welcomed more than 36 million visitors in 2024, bouncing back to pre-pandemic levels, and that’s a lot of people. Its hotspots like Montmartre, the Eiffel Tower, the Champs-Élysées feel the pressure most.
Annie Sargent: The deputy mayor in charge of tourism, Frédéric Ocard, says the city needs to regulate tourism in order to limit the negative effects. In his words, “We need to stabilize the number of tourists.” The buses are at the heart of the issue here. Between 500 and 600 tour buses, coaches, enter Paris every day, and 95% of them still run on diesel.
Annie Sargent: That’s a lot of exhaust and, you know, in an already congested neighborhood, the city is considering cutting back access to tour buses in central Paris for a long term solution. And then they could make people just park outside, take the RER, you know? But not everyone agrees, of course.
Annie Sargent: Tour guides argue that buses are the most practical option for groups. And it’s true that big buses, you know, if you work it out, it’s less gas consumption per head than an individual car. Public transportation is difficult with a large number of people, so I understand this. And the bus industry, they point out that coaches are essential for international tourism and that the big problem is the lack of designated parking.
Annie Sargent: Well, where are you going to put it in Montmartre? Like, I don’t know. The drivers feel stuck. Some say they have no choice but park illegally and drop people off, even if it means risking 135 Euro fine. But the city says they won’t turn a blind eye to those practices and are preparing stricter measures.
Annie Sargent: This is not a brand new debate. When Paris introduced its low traffic zone in the city center in 2024, tour buses were almost banned. Banned outright from certain districts, and they were given a reprieve but the question is still on the table. How do you strike a balance between welcoming millions of visitors and preserving the quality of life for the people who actually live in these neighborhoods?
Annie Sargent: The conversation is ongoing and Montmartre, with its steep streets and postcard views has become the frontline in this clash between mass tourism and local life.
Annie Sargent: Now, I use tour buses for the Bootcamp, sometimes you have to. But we stay well away from Paris with the Bootcamp, and as a matter of fact, guiding in Paris would be actually much easier for me than guiding in Toulouse, because I don’t guide in Toulouse that much.
Annie Sargent: Elyse takes all these jobs. I mean, I do a little bit, but really, not very much. I take people outside of Toulouse on day trips. But really, nobody needs me to bring more buses to Paris. If I ever did a Bootcamp in Paris, it would have, we would use public transportation. And as far as I see it, the solution to over-tourism is to spread people around.
Annie Sargent: There are so many great places to enjoy in France. I encourage you to get out and enjoy it all, not just Paris, Normandy and Provence, right? Many more places that we explore here on this podcast every week.
Annie Sargent: That’s it. The rant is over.
Annie Sargent: My thanks to podcast editors Anne and Christian Cotovan, who produced the transcripts and the audio.
[00:54:58] Next Week on the Podcast
Annie Sargent: Next week on the podcast, an episode with Elyse Rivin of Toulouse Guided Walks about the town of Saint-Lizier in the Ariège Department. … Saint what, you say? Saint-Lizier. And that’s exactly my point. This is one of these hidden gems that you need to hear about so perhaps you’ll consider not spending all your time in France in Montmartre, but rather go down to the foothills of the Pyrenees, where it is beautiful.
Annie Sargent: Thank you so much for listening, and I hope you join me next time so we can look around France together. Au revoir.
[00:55:33] Copyright
Annie: The Join Us in France travel podcast is written, hosted, and produced by Annie Sargent, and Copyright 2025 by AddictedToFrance. It is released under a Creative Commons attribution, non-commercial, no derivatives license.